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 Post subject: Aircraft
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:01 am 
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Woodward
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Does anyone know good rules for aircraft and aircraft combat? I am looking for something realistic.


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:15 am 
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Knight
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Assuming you mean air combat rules for RPG. DnD have (fairly good) rules about maneouverability and moving in rounds.

DnD Open Source

Even if DnD isn't your thing and much bad can be said about it, but it not all bad. At least, they can give some ideas of your own.
PS
I think it is the article named "Wilderness, Weather, and Environment" that contains the rules (and tables) how to move in 3d.

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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 10:26 am 
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Beadle
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Traveller D20 (T20) has some decent rules.
Air Superiority was a GDW (?) game I think that represented it well.
GURPS is too crunchy. but gets it done.

Star Warriors the Star Wars fighter game by West End games was the most FUN to play!


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 10:34 am 
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Beadle
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I am a playtester for a series of combat rules from WWI to modern era, that are very easy to learn, but with very realistic flight rules. The first module should see print this year.


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:01 pm 
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Knight
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Air Superiority/Air Strike/Speed of Heat are very good simulations of 20th century jet combat.

Wings of War is fairly decent for WW I.

Everything else I have seen is fairly lame IMHO.

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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 4:27 am 
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Beadle
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The problem with detailed aircraft (and most vehicle) combat rules is that the speeds are so great and the ranges so long that there isnt much sense to bother with detailed rules.

Unless you are having a dogfight at slow (Pre-jet speeds) its relatively boring for the player.

(More so in space combat where the scale is up-scaled to turns of sometimes 20 minutes.)

I have found it better to simulate through narration, and do skill vs skill rolls.


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:59 pm 
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Knight
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DucatiDon wrote:
The problem with detailed aircraft (and most vehicle) combat rules is that the speeds are so great and the ranges so long that there isnt much sense to bother with detailed rules.

Unless you are having a dogfight at slow (Pre-jet speeds) its relatively boring for the player.


I'm going to have to disagree here. The key, to my mind, is the extent to which player choices matter. In aircraft combat, the choices mainly revolve around maneuver. For modern air combat, certain long range air to air missles can remove the effectiveness of maneuver and become relatively uninteresting (roll dice to determine pilot fate). However, tailoring a scenario to create player choices, whether by making the use of such a weapon either ineffective (perhaps ground clutter) or undersirable (you've only got one, make it count), can create very interesting combats.

As an aside, with these games I only ever play the 'let's kill each other' scenario to learn the rules, since I tend to find those rather boring scenarios. I like to go for scenarios more like 'bomber escort' where both sides have an objective beyond a simple 'the other guy must die'.

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Last edited by Nichola on Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 2:24 am 
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Woodward
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Nichola, I tried looking up some of the titles you gave. I couldn't find anything on them, do you have any info on them or where I could find them?


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 9:18 am 
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Reeve
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You could also have a look at an older game called "Blue Max" and there is a variant available for WWII also.

Try doing a search for the listed games on boardgamegeek....


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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:01 am 
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Knight
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zakolev wrote:
Nichola, I tried looking up some of the titles you gave. I couldn't find anything on them, do you have any info on them or where I could find them?


Air Superiority and Air Strike were produced by GDW in the 80s and now out of print. Speed of Heat is their descendant and published by Clash of Arms games - I bought mine two years ago and I don't know if it is still in print. These are all jet aircraft games.

Wings of War is currently in print and in stock at my FLGS. I don't own it, but have played it and it seems a reasonable simulation. This is a WW I game.

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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 9:58 am 
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Knight
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DucatiDon wrote:
GURPS is too crunchy. but gets it done.


I thought GURPS dogfight rules in Space were good and lean. Same with Savage Worlds. Not simulationist at all.

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 Post subject: Re: Aircraft
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:12 pm 
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Reeve
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Nichola wrote:
Wings of War is currently in print and in stock at my FLGS. I don't own it, but have played it and it seems a reasonable simulation. This is a WW I game.


Now done with a WWII set.


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