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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2003 7:32 pm 
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Knight
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Patrick Nilsson wrote:
He told me because of the change in the autoship policy to only add the HQ issues, they had gotten quite a few new subscribers. Far quicker it seems than regular autoship. He also mentioned that the gameplan wasn't all that much slower than the gameplan for boardgames.


Well that's cool. I'd like to see 1000 HQ subscribers... heck, even 600-700 would be cool, and I think that's very doable, given time. :)

-Mark

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2003 8:10 pm 
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Yeoman
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I have of late been looking at RPGNow a fair amount. I have bought a couple of things that I can't get here, and I have been quite pleased. What it has lead me to think is as follows:

• RPGNow sells more than d20 material, and at some reasonable prices.
• The Harn Regional module could be offered either at low cost or for free at RPGNow - although the map would be only at reduced scale.
• The link between RPGNow and RPGShop means that gamers in remote areas have access to both electronic and print versions, thus the Harn Module could also be sold on the RPGShop - that way players would get a good quality map.
• The Harn OOP Kingdom modules could then be compiled into decent PDFs on an individual basis - Kanday, Tharda etc. - and sold only as PDFs; similarly the HQ's.

Why does this benefit CGI?
• They don't have to host the PDFs, saving space
• They access a broad customer base
• They hard part - writing - is done. The formatting would not take long.
• They could link RPGNow from the CGI site, as many other small games companies do.
• They would not face as much criticism over looseleaf as the electronic books fit this format and could be printed in the local paper size!
I know the scanning would not take too long as I did a test case with a different game. It took me 2 weeks to scan in, OCR, edit and add grapics of a 70 page rule book. I also edited in my own rules and corrected the OCR and original typos

Would all this be a benefit?
Well, the company that produce the "Magical Mediaeval Kingdom" book - 145 pages of excellent material (A book I heartily recommend) - produced a version 1.0 on RPGNow. They then added a revised version 1.5 with some errata cleared up - this also had the effect of keeping the module current. They then made enough to announce that the book will be produced in print later this year. They are not the only small games company to do this. The guys who produce the "Blood & ..." series put pdf versions on RPGNow to generate enough revenue to produce print version (sold through RPGShop and bricks and mortar shops) although those would have to be print versions properly bound.

The whole process could broaden the appeal of Harn - supporting CGI - and lead to a larger Harn customer base. This can benefit GamePlan and lead to sales of the Wargames too. It would also benefit us as the Gamers as CGI could then stop fretting about OOP material and concentrate on the development of new material.

Now, those who would say that the attempt to broaden the appeal of Harn, or say that the game is niche etc. are, at least IMO, killing off Harn. If the customer base does not grow, then it will not cope with those who stop gaming.

Let me go back to one point - the properly bound print versions - and explain why?
• I did a further test - I bought Blood & Space both as a pdf and printed version. The pdf version takes up about 2.5 times as much shelf space (which I don't have spare, so I did a lot of experimenting to get best fit). I don't deny that the looseleaf format looks neat in the plastic page protectors, but it is the print version that stays on my shelf (I'm not a convert, but I am far more tolerant of looseleaf when I can print it in A4, and that is a direct result of the discussions here on the Forum!)
• those ordering the print version will be expecting somethin more for their money. The Blood and Space print version is perfect bound and the cover is high quality - though amusingly the pages are b&w when you can print the pdf pages in colour.
• As I understand it, the "Magical Mediaeval Kingdom" will be hardcover, and I would be tempted to buy a print copy to reduce space on my shelf - plus I like hardcover :)

Declarations of Independence aside, CGI would reap the benefts of a wider audience, and we as the Harn Gamers would see Harn get a stronger support base on which to thrive. There may even be a market for glossing up the D20 Harn guide! :)

rgds nick

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2003 9:09 pm 
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Yeoman
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Patrick wrote:
Sorry no offense meant, just an opinion.

None taken :D

I am not a full on DoomMeister for Harn; the fan base is strong enough. I guess I am looking at it from the point of view of thriving. CGI has retreated to the internet-only policy which I disagree with. If other companies can survive quite happily and get more into print - I concede these companies are new and may not survive for long - but they are out there.

In our own games club, one of the players has put together the Black Seal magazine. Its on its second issue and we are writing the third. The first was staple bound, the secon perfect bound as will be the next issue. The magazine sells very well, an yet as it is a Modern Cthulhu focussed magazine I would suggest it is niche. But we have got it out there, got it reviewed and made it available. I am only looking at how to get that done for Harn.

rgds nick

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2003 9:41 pm 
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I think 'doom-saying' is rather strong; however, as a newcomer, I would like to point out that the only reason I hesitated to dive full-bore into Harn was the known hassle & delays of chasing key OOP material. Not inconsequential is the added cost of OOP material.

Some years ago I would not have botherd; certainly I would not have if I did not have a group ready and waiting.

And this situation will, I believe, hurt Columbia in the long run. I have spent $140 to date on Harn; Columbia only got $80 of that; the rest was spent on OOP stuff. Virtually all my future purchases will be for OOP materials. And once I buy OOP modules from Ebay & other sources, (which will not produce a dime of profit for Columbia) I certainly will not turn around and buy the re-released products.

So Columbia will see very little profit from a GM who plans to collect every kingdom module and region supplement. Not because I am not willing to support them, but because in order to do so I must seek out used OOP material. I would vastly prefer to budget $100 a month and simply hit the Columbia web site every month and nab brand-new material, fresh from the printers, until my collection was complete.

It just seems to be poor business practice to turn customers away.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 3:54 am 
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Knight
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Darth Tang wrote:
It just seems to be poor business practice to turn customers away.

In fact, that was one of the first things I learned about business: the worst thing you can do is go out of stock. A consumer could be a loyal user of your product for ten years; the day he goes into the store to buy your product and there isn't any on the shelf, he'll try another brand...and if he likes it, he'll switch and you'll never get him back.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 3:57 am 
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Knight
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Patrick Nilsson wrote:
That would have been a very cool thing to do. With loads of references to various printed HârnWorld and HârnMaster publications. It would probably get one or two interested. And with the Atlas having a regional map of Hârn this could easily be added to that package (but only the regional map).

We're clearly thinking along the same lines here, Patrick...although, as has been pointed out, it's something that should probably wait until the bulk of the OOP stuff is no longer OOP.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 7:59 am 
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Yeoman
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The OOP Stock out is a clear problem. One of the major stumbling blocks seems to be the desire to reformat. The only benefit for CGI of reformatting is the hope that the established Harniacs will support the product by adding to their existing collection. That is why I cannot see why CGI don't see the logic of getting the old stuff into a decent pdf format without reformatting and getting on to a decent electronic shelf!

rgds nick

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